Gun Control, A rational discussion Options

[Bargod]

I thought we'd take this discussion off the pic thread and give it it's own area. I'll start with the quote from Junkie:

Guns don't kill people. Crazy people kill people. With a gun, knife, or a wet noodle people are going to be violent with each other. I have several guns. Most of which have not been fired in years. I'm pretty sure I'm not going to shoot anyone but if someone chooses to come into my house uninvited they very well may get a double barreled chest full. Do I think the average person needs an assault rifle? Hell no. But should they be able to keep guns for defense and hunting purposes? For sure.

I have no bias towards one side or the other and find this an interesting topic. I know many people feel strongly one way or the other. I'm not one of those people.
Having said that, I would like to point out that "Crazy people" don't kill people. The majority of murders are between people who know each other. Guns make murder much easier to accomplish. So, gun owners are often the most successful murderers. This, of course, does not make all gun owners bad people. Anyone can lose their cool and when combined with alcohol can act out in violent ways. This is why it is illegal to carry guns into bars. If some drunk guys get into a fist fight nobody is likely to get killed. If somebody pulls a knife, things are going to get worse. I had two waiters who worked together get into a fight and one hit the other in the face with a pint glass. The glass just missed his carotid artery and his eye. What do you think would have happened if that guy had a gun? The guy who only has a scar on his face would have no face. The buddy of the guy that got hit in the face was close to breaking the attackers neck until I stepped in. What do you think would have happed to that guy after his friends head got blown off. Hell, in his drunken panic he could have shot at me just for being there. These two waiters drank together regularly. They got into a fight over who won the most pool games in the bar they were in before they came to mine. They were betting a nickel a game!!!

I won't say all gun owners are potential murderers, but you are less likely to kill somebody in a murderous rage if you don't have a gun. This is one of the reasons I don't want to have a gun in my house. I like to drink and sometimes I get very pissed off at people.

Guns do protect homeowners. Last year a little old lady living in public housing down the street from me shot and killed an intruder in her home. He was unarmed, but she didn't know that, and he wouldn't have needed a weapon to do bodily harm to her anyway. She's an example of the positive side of gun ownership.

I also don't buy into the "more guns means safer citizens" arguement. Australia has very strict gun control and it's murder rate has gone down. The reason? There are fewer murders involving guns. This means that what could have been a murder is more likely now just an assault.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2004/06/08/1127171.htm

I personally think Michael Moore is a self agrandizing ego maniac, but he made some decent points in Bowling for Columbine.
It is very unlikely that incident would have been possible if it weren't for the weapons they used. Even if they were limited to revolvers and single shot hunting rifles it would have been a different result.

I don't claim to have any answers, but I'd like to hear other oppinions on this.

[THE Mechanic]

Boy this post is steaming..

The Capt. and MOD should meet at high noon.

Choose your weapons boys..Spitballs are your weapons.

The first one to get it between the EYE's ...looses..lol..



Here's an example for you.

I'n New York state you must have a pistol license.And thier not easy to get.. It could take as long as a year with background checks,and they dig deep.If you so much as farted up wind you could be denied.

I dont know about upstsate,but downstate in New York city and Long Island if you are caught with a hand gun unregistered and unlicence you will do a year in jail.



My neighbour owns a club in China town.And he had a registered pistol licence to carry because he deals with receipts etc.He had been having lots of problems with gang activity and other bad asses crashing his club.

One night about three years ago 3 punks showed up at the club and pulled guns demanding his receipts.

Well they messed with the wrong person. "Steve" shot two of them dead on the spot and the other ran off.

The NYPD did an investigation and it was considered a justifyable shooting.no charges filed.

I asked him how he felt about it and he said"everything happen so fast"they were going to shoot me..it was either me or them..!! He says he felt really bad about killing these young people but he really had no other option.

After this happened a few months later he decided to make his club a private club.

Here's the worst part the NYPD took his gun and then told him he can no longer posses a fire arm.And revoked his license in definately in the state of New York.

He still carries heat to this day regardless and said "I'm going home to my family tonight".

He has had no holdups to date.I guess the word got out on the street,and changing the club to a membership club helps as well.



"T.M."

[Bargod]

Boy this post is steaming..

The Capt. and MOD should meet at high noon.

Choose your weapons boys..Spitballs are your weapons.

The first one to get it between the EYE's ...looses..lol..



Here's an example for you.

I'n New York state you must have a pistol license.And thier not easy to get.. It could take as long as a year with background checks,and they dig deep.If you so much as farted up wind you could be denied.

I dont know about upstsate,but downstate in New York city and Long Island if you are caught with a hand gun unregistered and unlicence you will do a year in jail.



My neighbour owns a club in China town.And he had a registered pistol licence to carry because he deals with receipts etc.He had been having lots of problems with gang activity and other bad asses crashing his club.

One night about three years ago 3 punks showed up at the club and pulled guns demanding his receipts.

Well they messed with the wrong person. "Steve" shot two of them dead on the spot and the other ran off.

The NYPD did an investigation and it was considered a justifyable shooting.no charges filed.

I asked him how he felt about it and he said"everything happen so fast"they were going to shoot me..it was either me or them..!! He says he felt really bad about killing these young people but he really had no other option.

After this happened a few months later he decided to make his club a private club.

Here's the worst part the NYPD took his gun and then told him he can no longer posses a fire arm.And revoked his license in definately in the state of New York.

He still carries heat to this day regardless and said "I'm going home to my family tonight".

He has had no holdups to date.I guess the word got out on the street,and changing the club to a membership club helps as well.



"T.M."

My second cousin, Harold Bringman, ran a club in NYC as well. Not sure if he had a license for his gun or not, but most likely won't get another license any time in the future...

Yes, I'm taking my own thread off topic...

http://www.usdoj.gov/usao/nys/pressrelease...roconvicted.pdf