| ScrapyardBob |
01/06/06 1:25am
Post
#1
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Major ![]() Group: {MOB} Posts: 814 Joined: January 6th 2006 Member No.: 1519 Xfire: scrapyardbob |
(because I can't sleep at the moment)
So let's talk about the odd, the crafty, the nifty, and the common sense of the Barbarossa map. Focusing primarily on "base assault" mode, although the map is also well suited for CTF. (Definitely a favorite map of a lot of folks.) Apologies in advance if I get long-winded and please try to keep it civil. There's a lot of opinion when folks talk about tactics and just about any idea works at least part of the time. If you don't like a tactic, please explain how you would beat that tactic rather then deriding the poster. First off, my impressions of the bases. Russian #1 (N flank) - Moderately difficult to defend. German attack is usually through the W pass, but sometimes they come up the river valley to the south. Or, if Russian #3 has already fallen, germans can swipe tanks and attack along the back road. Germans also tend to slip into the house on the SW side where the anti-tank weapons are stored. The tank parked near #1 is a prime theft target. - This base tends to be ignored by most allied players, making it more difficult to defend, but easier to attack. Russian #2 (S flank, forward position) - Moderately to extremely difficult to defend. The germans can attack this base from the S riverbed, through the town that is downslope, from the hilltop pass to the NW, or from the N flank. Tanks have to be rushed forward (on a constant basis) from the rear to protect this base. - Strategically, only worth defending if you are behind on points. Same problems as German #1. Only inexperienced players attack this base first (or plant bombs here first). Smart players leave this base alone, forcing the enemy to spawn at a base without any nearby tanks. Russian #3 (SE flank, rear position) - Easiest to defend, unless everyone is playing offense and nobody is minding the store. Germans can sneak in through the houses or sneak in via the right flank into the russian spawn area. - If the germans fail to destroy this base before the other 2 bases, the round typically ends up as a stalemate (or loss). German #1 (S flank, forward position) - Difficult to defend. The russians have multiple approaches to the base (south riverbed, the town bridge, down the hill from the hilltop pass, or up the valley from the N bridge). - Strategically, only worth defending if you are behind on points. Same problems as Russian #2. Only inexperienced players attack this base first (or plant bombs here first). Smart players leave this base alone, forcing the enemy to spawn at a base without any nearby tanks. German #2 (S flank, rear position) - Moderately easy to defend, but only if actively guarded. Russians either sneak through the tank park, attack via the N road, or sneak up the S road. - A lot of players ignore this base until it's too late. They won't start defending it until it's open and has been planted once. An early russian offensive on this base typically results in a win for the allies. Leaving this base for last usually results in a stalemate or loss. German #3 (N flank) - Moderately easy to defend. Attacks are typically from the N bridge, the hilltop pass to the SE, or russians sneaking up the back road or past the bush at the german anti-tank gun. - This is a strategically important base for the germans. Guarding #3 also allows them to guard their N flank. Losing #3 typically results in germans forgetting to watch the N flank, allowing the russians to attack the german spawn. -------------------- |
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| ScrapyardBob |
01/22/06 2:33am
Post
#2
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Major ![]() Group: {MOB} Posts: 814 Joined: January 6th 2006 Member No.: 1519 Xfire: scrapyardbob |
More thoughts on strategy:
1) Just because you've lost the base on a particular hill is no reason not to give up control over that hill. The germans have a bad habit of ignoring their right flank after G2 falls (as everyone rushes to the defense of G3). Same issue when they lose G3 (but not as severe because it's easier to exit the tank park and drive past G3). The russians have a bad habit of ignoring the R1 hill on the right flank after R1 has been lost. If you want action, setup shop on a hill where the base has been destroyed. A sneaky russian infantryman on the R2 hill can provide early warning against left flank attacks. You can also be a huge thorn in the side of any german tanks who think it's fun to setup shop on the R2 hill and shell R3. Germans at the ruined G1 base are a nasty surprise to any russian tank that is attempting to slip in via the south road. Half of the time that I attempt to bring a tank into play at G2 I end up getting damaged by a german hiding in the ruins of G1. 2) A single tank on the north pass by Russian #1 can hold off a lot of armor. A pair of players at the north pass (one on the 45mm and the other in a tank) can hold off even more germans. The north pass at Russian #1 is a great place to practice turret-down and hull-down defense in a heavy tank (see the Wikipedia link for details). Most of the time, while waiting for targets you should go turret-down. (Stay on the lee side of the hill and you should just barely be able to see the bridge area over the crest of the hill in front of you.) A good analogy is to be like a tunnel spider, waiting for flies to wander into your kill zone. When you are turret-down, germans down at the bridge will not know your location unless they are using binoculars or a sniper scope. As soon as you see movement down at the north bridge, you should alert teammates and creep forward to a hull-down position. Just after you creep forward enough to fire, you should reverse direction and creep backwards right before firing. This will give you a slight downward angle on your gun elevation, allowing you to hit lower targets without moving forward into a more exposed position. By rocking forward then back you are only exposed long enough to get a round off and you provide a very difficult firing solution for german gunners down at the bridge area. No-so-smart germans will panic as the shells begin to fall. They'll attempt to backup to the cover of the house by the N bridge. This can cause traffic jams if you panic the first tank in the armor column. Basically, if you can keep them from crossing that bridge you'll probably win the engagement. Sometimes without taking any damage to your tank. Smarter germans will realize that they need to advance at speed in order to get out of the kill zone. If the germans manage to get 2-3 vehicles into the N road fields, you're probably going to have a difficult time. Make every shot count. Hopefully, you had already notified your team about the german advance and have reinforcements on the way. If not, now is the time to cry for help (although it's going to be late to the party). If you have enemy infantry as far forward as the 45mm gun, it's time to fall back and attempt to keep them from getting over the north pass and into the house behind you. (Remember the primary goal of defense is to deny territory and disrupt the enemy's plans / timetable. Stay alive and make them pay in time/blood for every meter of ground. The longer it takes them to advance, the greater the chance of your reinforcements arriving and driving off the assault.) The other problem that you will face is germans sneaking in via the middle opening, walking up the riverbed towards R1 and shooting you in the rump. The only real solution for that is to rely on teammates to watch those sectors. -------------------- |
ScrapyardBob Barbarossa tactics and strategy 01/06/06 1:25am
ScrapyardBob The anti-tank weapons and their uses during a base... 01/06/06 1:50am
Maj. H8Red
Russian W: (forward middle)
- Can shell Germa... 01/06/06 12:42pm
ScrapyardBob Defense (general): Not a complete list, but some ... 01/06/06 2:34am
Bargod WOW! You've got a lot of time on your han... 01/06/06 4:04am
+KS+ Blinky Bill Hi, ScrapyardBob! :)
You surely have spent ... 01/06/06 5:24am
Cpt.Canuck Post of the year, Bob! Well done. :)
One th... 01/06/06 11:05am
ScrapyardBob Hitting the entrance of Russian #3 with the Russia... 01/06/06 6:08pm
ScrapyardBob It's amazing how much mayhem erupts behind rus... 01/11/06 11:30pm
Cpt.Canuck
Looks like the russian 45mm (Russian 3N: rear... 01/12/06 10:44am
realdeal Good work Bob! Maybe you could post some scre... 01/12/06 9:22am
Hellfighter I hate me sometimes.
I just spent over an hour on... 01/12/06 5:46pm
Maj. H8Red
I hate me sometimes.
So do I......lol espe... 01/12/06 5:59pm
ScrapyardBob This great map has a trove of hideaways and ambus... 01/12/06 6:51pm
Hellfighter
Anyone know how many hits it takes to destroy t... 01/13/06 11:03am
Hellfighter
My defense against stealthy infiltrators is to ... 01/14/06 10:08pm
ScrapyardBob Let's see if pictures work...
I had talke... 01/12/06 6:25pm
Cpt.Canuck Slyk, new map looks great! Can't wait... 01/12/06 7:00pm
realdeal Thanks for all the info guys. Nince work Bob... 01/13/06 11:58am
Slyk German pak gun is 75mm. Russian is 45mm. Their d... 01/13/06 3:51pm
ScrapyardBob So... experimentation time. Playing around with t... 01/14/06 3:43am
ScrapyardBob Russian #3 45mm stationary gun targeting chart
... 01/14/06 10:23am
ScrapyardBob Russian #3 KV1 (heavy) tank targeting chart
... 01/14/06 11:39am
ScrapyardBob Russian middle KV1 (heavy) tank targeting chart
... 01/14/06 2:10pm
ScrapyardBob German #3 left-side PzIII shelling targets
... 01/14/06 3:13pm
ScrapyardBob German left-size PzIV (facing east in tank spawn)
... 01/14/06 3:25pm
Silver alot of what you say is awesome, but....
sniping ... 01/14/06 5:04pm
ScrapyardBob Nah he can keep that position.
I spent way to... 01/14/06 9:37pm
ScrapyardBob Satchels - always carry a satchel!
There a... 01/15/06 11:30am
Hellfighter A while back I read a G.I's WW2 war story and ... 01/15/06 1:21pm
Silver dropping the satchel down the air tube also works ... 01/15/06 1:23pm
Imphotemp it would be nice to know sweet spots to german AT_... 01/16/06 8:25am
Silver soon as i fix my vent i could ask someone to spot ... 01/16/06 9:25am
ScrapyardBob The pak gun by german #3 doesn't have any swee... 01/16/06 9:35am
ScrapyardBob The goals of defense
See also: FM 17-15 chapter... 01/16/06 10:26am
Hellfighter
3) Cry for help. If you're about to die... 01/16/06 11:41am
Imphotemp jeezz....BOB you must have used many many hours to... 01/16/06 11:04am
Hellfighter jeezz....BOB you must have used many many hours t... 01/16/06 12:00pm
ScrapyardBob Takes about 1 hour to setup each targeting chart a... 01/16/06 11:43am
ScrapyardBob Russian defense. Talking specifics about defense ... 01/16/06 5:13pm
realdeal Excellent, as usual. And remember Russians... Onl... 01/16/06 5:41pm
ScrapyardBob The germans are getting a lot smarter. First roun... 01/16/06 11:57pm
Hellfighter The germans are getting a lot smarter. First rou... 01/17/06 9:39am
ScrapyardBob True, luck-o-the-draw does apply.
It's a to... 01/17/06 10:32am
Slyk Concept for debate:
You are Russian. You man the ... 01/18/06 10:18am
Maj. H8Red
You are Russian. You man the North Road 45mm. M... 01/18/06 11:55am
Silver you would be correct since soon as the tanks pass ... 01/18/06 10:46am
Hellfighter you would be correct since soon as the tanks pass... 01/18/06 11:43am
Slyk As we designed the map and vehicles, we readily un... 01/18/06 2:22pm
Maj. H8Red I think the North road is overlooked alot early in... 01/18/06 3:25pm
Slyk I decided not to put too many vehicles near the fr... 01/18/06 3:34pm
Maj. H8Red yeah, sometimes the "easiest/closest" ba... 01/18/06 3:47pm
ScrapyardBob Yeah, losing the right flank around Russian #1 is ... 01/20/06 9:34am
Slyk
One tactic that I haven't seen discussed yet... 01/20/06 11:34am
Maj. H8Red Slyk, is there a timeframe for completion for this... 01/20/06 3:18pm
ScrapyardBob One thought I had looking at the early map (from y... 01/20/06 9:17pm
Maj. H8Red Will the vehicles be stock, or current Barb tanks?... 01/21/06 1:40am
ScrapyardBob Size-wise, how does the BAS area for the new Barba... 01/22/06 1:31am
ScrapyardBob Other hull-down defensive / offense positions on t... 01/22/06 10:53am
ScrapyardBob It's good map design to keep the bases from be... 01/22/06 2:30pm
ScrapyardBob Why do I suspect tonight's south flank rush of... 01/23/06 10:06pm
Hellfighter Why do I suspect tonight's south flank rush o... 01/25/06 6:01pm
Maj. H8Red One of those quick matches you just love to hate, ... 01/24/06 2:21am
ScrapyardBob Hah, no, I was the sucker that stayed behind to we... 01/24/06 4:32pm
ScrapyardBob (I feel your pain about trying to get more then 3 ... 01/25/06 7:14pm
realdeal Please post all Barbarossa II related posts HERE. ... 01/25/06 9:25pm
ScrapyardBob Okay, here's a very sweet spot for the germans... 01/28/06 11:46am
ScrapyardBob General notes about attempting to hit Russian #3 f... 01/28/06 12:02pm
Maj. H8Red Aha, now it's time for German strategy..... 01/28/06 12:07pm
ScrapyardBob Yeah, auto-assign has been cruel to me this week, ... 01/28/06 12:20pm
Maj. H8Red With a tank at G3 & the PAK near 1 & 2 you... 01/28/06 12:34pm
ScrapyardBob More newbie moments.
1. Never assume that the s... 02/05/06 11:49am
Undertow
Or I'll just play dead on the floor with a p... 02/05/06 1:54pm
Hellfighter
Or I'll just play dead on the floor with a ... 02/05/06 7:03pm
ScrapyardBob (evil grin at Cpt Canuck)
Yeah, I know it's... 02/05/06 4:49pm
ScrapyardBob A lot of players are getting a lot smarter about l... 02/13/06 12:36am
flatliner if you are ranked high enough,
you cna go absolu... 02/13/06 1:09am
Cpt.Canuck It's funny how tactics have changed, eh...
1)... 02/13/06 9:39am
Hellfighter It's funny how tactics have changed, eh...
1... 02/21/06 4:33am
ScrapyardBob When I'm on a defuse run, tactics vary based o... 02/13/06 12:22pm
Cpt.Canuck
Long-range fire support is starting to fail m... 02/13/06 12:55pm
The-Crazy-Norwegian ScrapyardBob, I think you can make a PhD on Barbar... 02/20/06 12:52pm
ScrapyardBob We should pin this topic... 03/25/06 7:09pm
ScrapyardBob Notes for the admins:
- The default respawn tim... 04/05/06 10:39am
ScrapyardBob Things that I saw while watching the mayhem on Bar... 04/05/06 10:15pm
Maj. H8Red Thank God for spawnkilling :D 04/06/06 1:12am
Angus Thermopyle Damn, finally got through all of the tips here. I... 09/20/06 8:50am
majorhavoc
ScrapyardBob make a good point with this.
On m... 09/20/06 10:10am
Angus Thermopyle One more jeep point.
When you are manning the MG ... 09/20/06 1:51pm
Goner Same goes for anyone hopping on the mg of a tank.... 01/29/07 9:14am
M@ster of Dis@ster
Same goes for anyone hopping on the mg of a tank... 01/29/07 12:41pm
Stryker9 ALSO, when using a MG with the slider bar ammo,
us... 09/20/06 2:17pm
Glyn Gardner A new trick I have been toying with that has been ... 11/29/06 1:54am
Nothing Agree, that works well against the Russians.
This... 11/29/06 12:08pm
M@ster of Dis@ster Winning with Russian is easier...period. 11/30/06 6:27pm
Glyn Gardner Found another team tactic that worked well last ni... 12/02/06 9:26am
MyWifesMule " I for one really appreciate a top gunner to... 01/29/07 9:45am![]() ![]() |
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