Hi, how is everyone today? I haven't posted in quite some time, but I neede to get something off of my chest. I play almost exclusively on MOB servers because of the great people and the great custom maps, particulary Tuchola Forrest, my personal favorite. It seems as of late there is some team stacking going on, not from MOB members, but from other clan members joining together, and usually lead by one clan in particular, who's name I will not mention at this time. I was on last night, playing against one of these stacked teams and a couple of MOB members were with me on vent and expressed their displeasure as well. I have to admit, I haven't read all of the MOB rules, but from my experiences, from being in clans and playing on clan servers, I've often seen little tolerance for deliberate team stacking. Don't get me wrong, I love a good challange, but the last several times I've been on, I've seen clan members, sitting in spectator waiting to hop on the team with all the clan members. That same thing just happened, lead by the same unnamed clan I mentioned earlier, which is what finally prompted me to make a post. I would just like to know if anyone else is a little OVERHEATED by this and if so can anything be done about it. If nothing can be done, I guess I will just have to play a little harder or try harder to get on the stacked team, LOL Everyone have a great day and I appreciate you letting me vent my spleen in your forums.



P.S. Sorry for any mispellings, but the spell check doesn't work, lol. KLINK

Next time they are on ask them to stop team stacking and if they give you any hard time let me know.

Funny you say that, because I was thinking it this morning.

This particular clan are good guys, but they don't have their own server so they set up camp at Tuchola.
Which is fine of course. But they all have the voice chat and it puts us at a disadvantage if we are few in numbers.

I was thinking that it would be good to have some additional MOB guys drop into Tuchola when they have time and give Overheated and Klink some support. I try to when I can, but I do love stocks and Barb.

p.s. One of the server rules is "keep the teams balanced". They should know that.

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Yeah , i have seen this too, oberst. I have seen alot of clans do this. i know they want to be with their friends, but sometimes when teams are obviously unfair, like rounds going by in a matter of 5 minutes, something needs to be done. im with ya bro.

It's done the whole clan will be BAN!

I am a member of the group you are talking about. AWOL has been playing MOB servers for over a year. We had servers, but shut them down because we were always here. Your servers are consistantly populated with mostly talented players.

Our clan as well as OMC, 66thDiv. and even some independant players usually will join the same team. I doesnt make much sence to talk tactics with the other team on ventrilo. A lot of the times, we are the only ones in the server. Everyone knows that people wont join an empty server. I would like to think we have something to do with populating the server. We have a link on our website. We have recently had members donate to MOB. We even try to keep the peace on the Tuch server when no MOB members are in.

Now, because a few noobs complain, we get called out. Fine. If you fell the need to kick us, ban us, its your server, we understand. But, you can ask anyone that go up against us nightly, we play clean, and we win.





Hulka

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Great screenshot, too bad it was taken completely out of context. I feel I show respect to MOB members as well as other players.

Since when is one clan joining the same team, cheating?





Hulka

Thats funny I see the samething on the Barbarossa map, but its not AWOL, its MOB members that stack the teams. If we tell other clans not to stack the teams, should'nt we not stack the teams also?

this is true, hammatime and bargod arent allowed to play anymore lol

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Barkman actually makes a good point. It is in the MOB rules that teams should not be stacked. These days on our UO servers it is sometimes akward to accuse a clan of team stacking on our servers because too often our own members do it. I was on the forest today and I didn't even care that there were 3 or 4 AWOL guys on the same team. I find it far more annoying to get on a server and find many MOB stacked on one team. I'm not saying it happens all the time, but you can see where it would be hard to kick or ban if our own members are doing it without consequence.
That is why we should always try to hit auto assign. Sometimes chance puts us together on a team. If it becomes lopsided, just try to change sides when you can.

HOWEVER, the people that pay to keep up these servers do not do it to allow another team a "practice" area. As much as it bothers me that we do it ourselves, these guys pay to keep up our servers. I'm sure AWOL guys have donated as well (haven't checked, but I bet there has been some) but you understand that we don't keep up servers for you to play as a team against others.

Now, we need to lead by example. We should always try to keep the teams evenly split. If we expect others to do it, we must show them that we do it ourselves.

Problem with auto-assign is people will wait for others to join the opposition then can hit auto-assign and get on the team they wanted.

I've said it before though and it bears repeating:
How much fun is it really to go in and win in 5 mins?
Balanced teams where you have to really fight to destroy the bases is much more enjoyable as far as I'm concerned.
Probably the most fun I've had on the servers was a match where neither team was able to destroy a single bunker because both sides were so evenly matched.

Not sure what can be done to police the team-stacking issue though. A ban does seem excessive. Maybe a message via the console to keep the teams even, and warning about kicks if it's not followed?
Of course you'd need an admin there to enforce it, but there's usually someone on.

I don't think I've played in many games where everyone in MOB was on the same team.
Even on Barb, unless there were only a couple of us.

I don't want anyone banned. I like the AWOL guys.

But since you called MOB scum, I might have to come into Tuchola every day to spank your ass around.

Hulka, did your team read the FAQ thread: http://www.mobclan.com/forums/upload/index...?showtopic=9802



The game server rules for MOB state: No Team Stacking
If the talent is overwhelmingly lopsided, a {MOB} Member may request a player to switch sides.
If requested to switch teams, please do so.
Also, please auto-select a team when joining a game, this will help but not insure teams stay even.
If there are multiple players from the same clan in the server, we require they divide themselves up between the two teams.



T/A6Pak

AWOL as a whole! Not individually.

I am quite disappointed! Thought you guys were a class act! I am not sure of the entirety of what transpired, but what I read reflects poorly on you guys! I think you guys should be on here apologizing!

This is your home away from home! I can't believe some of this. You guys know better!

MAN!
SH

WoW! Didn't mean to cause such a stir. This was quite an issue when I was in TxM, so I should have known, lol. I hate to see the members banned, as I have never had a cross word with any of them myself. They all seem to be decent folk and ferocious players. Also, I may not be the best player around, but I ain't no noob, LOL.



Can't we all just get along?

if i may chime in.

i play against the AWOL clan all the time. they are, as we all know, talented players. it can get rather discouraging at times when they "happen" to all be on the same side. we know that there are rules against stacking and now that this is out in the open i am sure they will abide. i would respectfully request that the talk about banning them be greatly tempered and allow them to adjust their play to comply with the server rules on their own. i would like to point out that their attendance on the forrest is constant and accounts a lot for the activity on that map. i (as inconsequential as i am) don't want to see them leave and don't want them chased out.

i was talking to my usual bunch on vent the other evening when this latest occurrence happened and i voiced that what we really need is (as shred alluded to) is a better showing of the opposition. i realize that that too could possibly get out of hand but i get fearful when talk of "kicking / banning" is the used as the first option to deal with a scenario that simply discussion may correct. seems a bit heavy handed.

i would like to ask a question out loud if i may - the "AWOL Clan" if that is how they/you wished to be thought of. at one time used to be able to support their own server/games and web site - i have been to their site but it looks a bit deserted. they now seem to play exclusively on the MOB - Forest. it seems a bit odd to me that the AWOL clan has taken up residence on a MOB clans server. i would think the natural progression of a broken clan would be to a ) fade away or b ) the joining of another clan by their members - say (you guessed it) MOB. but in this case they seemed to have put their HQ somewhere back by German 3. maybe there is a lot more to this then i am aware but it strikes me as a bit odd but i am again a noob and don't profess to know "how things work".

AWOL please take the criticism constructively and abide by server rules. i for one would miss driving over the north bridge and having my jeep shot out from underneath me by %$# HULKA @#$@. i am sure that the AWOL bunch are communicating while playing so i might offer that they use vent and interact with some of the other usual players there in an attempt to bring more cohesion so that future situations may be less dramatic. "lets play".

*MR* Overheated

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i think bargods post is the one to read here.i dont think WHERE awol decides to play every day really matters ,clan means community and playing with your friends. these guys play on our tuchola server the same reason a lot of our guys play on barb ,to play against the best in a competitive environment amongst your friends . this shouldn't be a trash talk post because were talking about a ban of long time players.what hulka has posted is what Ive seen for a while on the tf server, there's more than one clan who team stack and I've seen it personally.i think if this was barb and one night mob was on one side and awol on the other and people complained ,it would be a different story.

to awol-i do have to say if the teams are uneven and a mob or reg has asked you to switch up the teams a bit ,it should be done. shiftys right ,its lame to win in 5 min.

hello to all you that i get the chance to play with/against - pretty much everyday - those that know me know i suck, but nonetheless,,,,,,,,

first off, for whoever wasnt even on the server at the time...

it was 8 on eight or something like that

ther might have been 4 maybe 5 of us and yes on the same team except for one

someone mentioned something about evening the teams, which at 8 on 8 basically everyone is wating for more people to join

well obviously 3 or 4 of us cant just jump on to the other team and start playing 12 on 4

so we all left and went to the german front mod server where it was only us playing

and radiation - who seems to be very kick happy - came over there -where it was only us mind you

and kicked us all out of THAT server, doesnt make sense really, sounds like a bully to me

i think he got picked on too much in high school, anyhoo

every time i have had the pleasure to play with/against him he tries to kick someone, - odd

and if your gonna give us an ultimatem (sp.?), we should have more than 5 seconds to comply.

even so, we left the server then were kicked out of the other one,

if anyone should be banned/kicked it should be radiation, before you lose all the people that like playing on your awesome server



as for why we are here- it was definitly for the level of competition we found on here.

lots of servers to choose from, i think you guys should be proud we chose this one[url="java script:emoticon("][/url] , not question why we are here.

earlier in the day, there were two of us awol fellers, against 7 or 8 mob guys

which of course gave us the beating of a lifetime, we didnt care, glad to see more of you guys on there

thanks for the opportunity to play on here





steve hansen

Hi Prv.Stevo,

Played with you many times and I never recall any problems with you. The AWOL clan has made a home in some of our servers which isn't a problem. The problem comes when there is team stacking and profanity in the server chat. We at MOB try to encourage the public to come to our servers and feel at home. This means that profanity should be kept to your vent channel not on our server chat. We have some younger players in our clan and alot of family members... so profanity will get you kicked.

We ask is that you don't team stack, keep the game fun. I realize when you're on vent with others it's always nice to be able to communicate and work as a team, but this is a public server that has alot of regular players from different clans.

When we receive a complaint, we investigate it and try to bring about a fair decision in keeping everyone happy.

T/A6Pak

Barb is on of our most popular servers (I think).

Many of us have been Regs on there for over a year and are literally addicted to it, as are many others. Stacking on there has been an issue and I feel has been dealt with as best as it can. I do take just as much pleasure in killing a reg who is on vent so they can curse at me, or vice versa. BUT it is also nice to play with talented people on your team. Some games, we just have people on the server that need to be beaten, badly. Campers, screw arounds, coughnoobscough, or any other undesireables, who might just need to see what happens when the powers unite. IT is good sometimes for people on the servers to see what a skilled unit looks like. Sometimes it looks stacked but is not.... Put Jibble, Havoc, 6feet, ipfreely, Opus X, deathwish, sgt clark, fwd1, or a few of the others whom kill us all on the same team, it would look like there are a few MFD guys with a bunch of normal players, and even with all of us on one team, even on vent, we would have a long day ahead... But that is rare and infrequent. I like to wait to join, to see whom is on both teams, from a vent standpoint, and a teammate standpoint. If nothing is on vent with me and spartan, than a game of ping pong is afoot, and I will select that team, sue me. Other than that, I go auto, or "educated select".



Kisses,

-------------------------------------

I just stumbled on this thread and wanted to say that me and the other two MFD guys (IPFreely and 6FootUnder) usually DO play on the same team and we're normally (75% of the time) using Skype to chat during the game. Sometimes my brother, ssgtfazz, is on our team, too, and joins us on Skype. We just like to play together to see how we do against the stiff competition on Barbarossa.

I guess because the teams (at least at night) are normally pretty well balanced, I don't think I recall ever being asked to change teams or to not team stack. As flatliner says, there are enough non-MOB regulars on the Barbarossa server that even if there are 12 or 13 MOB or Regs on one team, the other team can usually hold its own.

However, we are most definitely willing to break up our little party into different teams if you want us to do so. We are obviously guests and are willing to abide by the rules as we love to play Barbarossa!

Just my $0.02...and I'm sure I can speak for the other members of my party.

we of course understand the stacking thing and will be more cognizent of it

as far as language, i def dont think any of us swear on the server, or can ever remember it happening with us, as we totally agree on that subject, if anyone knows of any time thats happend let us know,

except for "mob scum" which is subjective, and maybe in rare instances, probably true, hehe

oh and i want to appologize to anyone that thinks we use it for a "practice" server, cus its not the case

but can understand where it may look that way. really nothing to practice for, we dont scrim or anything.

unless evil and mokurai are on the same team - i consider that a scrim against them fer sure

I must say, I really do enjoy playing ping pong with Spartan and Flat. The only problem is that the Germans usually end up quitting.

Hi Lip!

Hey Pvt.Stevo,

Thanks, trust me... we would much rather be playing than having to police the servers and kick people. We all enjoy a great competiton which makes us better players. I think at one time or another we've all had our butt's kicked and handed to us on a silver platter...LOL.

Hopefully this can be all resolved and we can get back to the battlefield!!

T/A6Pak

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needed to get more popcorn...................................................











ok carry on

Great discussion. (For the record I auto-assign immediately, but I really like the KAR98 rifle so I prefer to be German.)
As a player that is finally starting to learn the ins and outs of Barbarossa,
I have noticed a few things lately. (Typically in the evening matches)
It appears that when a majority of "newer" players end up on the German team it is a slaughter.
I believe that the Russian side can handle this better, but it becomes an all out war dying a million times defending 3!

I believe this is because the PAK shots are easier on the Russian side, and if the Russians have only (1) talented Long-shot player they can totally destroy the Germans.
(Killing G1 Pak, Dropping G2, Dropping G3, Killing Pak and tanks at G3, Firing into spawn Etc)
Couple that with the fact that if you don't watch G3 after it's dropped the spawn becomes a free for all.

When you are playing a 9 on 9 and only have 3 or 4 experienced players on the German side vs. 5 or 6 experienced players on the Russian side things get out of hand fast.

A good indicator is when I see the KV's rumbling all over the German side of the battlefield
and all of the German bases are dropped (with the exception of 1 of course ) in the first couple of min's. and the Germans are struggling to blow up any base except 2

Once this begins, the experienced players fight for their lives by playing D and it is a long struggle.
The solution is to drop the Russian bases with tanks shots thus keeping the Russians in check playing defense.
Sadly, I only have one of those base shots in my arsenal. (Although I'm practicing them all!)

All this being said if the Germans have a couple of players that can drop 1 and 3 quick a great game ensues!

So while these games are not "team stacking" it would be nice that after a team hands out a total
beat down in the first round that a better player or 2 would switch sides when the opportunity presents itself. I will try to my best to switch if I can, although me being a better player is debatable!

Hope this does not sound like sour grapes,
I really don't care about how many times I die I just like playing well-fought battles.
There is nothing finer than an organized assault to crush a well-defended base as time expires!

Now get out there and fight!

*MR* Blitz

I've never heard any of this before! Do tell!

LMAO!!!

[quote name='Pvt. Stevo' date='03/07/07 10:19am' post='143180'] hello to all you that i get the chance to play with/against - pretty much everyday - those that know me know i suck, but nonetheless,,,,,,,,
first off, for whoever wasnt even on the server at the time...
it was 8 on eight or something like that
ther might have been 4 maybe 5 of us and yes on the same team except for one

<<someone mentioned something about evening the teams, which at 8 on 8 basically everyone is wating for more people to join well obviously 3 or 4 of us cant just jump on to the other team and start playing 12 on 4>>



'Pvt. Stevo' That my be true but the problem I've seen was some of you were in Spec and you only joined when you could get in on your own team. I was the one to ask you to even up sides. One of you ask why and before I could even answer several more jumped in with sarcastic remarks like...I'll remove my tags, change my name and so on. When I ask to even up sides it wasn't meant the to be the player count, it was simply meant to even the odds which none of you gave me the chance to explain. You got mad and left and I believe you were the only one to stay for awhile longer.





<<so we all left and went to the german front mod server where it was only us playing
and radiation - who seems to be very kick happy - came over there -where it was only us mind you
and kicked us all out of THAT server, doesnt make sense really, sounds like a bully to me
i think he got picked on too much in high school, anyhoo>>



To plead your case the above is not the way to do it and IMHO appears to me you are still angry. When you guys moved on as you say, you guys were the only ones playing on that server. That means you had to be playing against each other. Why did you not stay in TF and simply say something like "OK we will try to even out the odds on the next game?" That's all it would have taken and this long thread wouldn't have happened.



<<every time i have had the pleasure to play with/against him he tries to kick someone, - odd
and if your gonna give us an ultimatem (sp.?), we should have more than 5 seconds to comply.

even so, we left the server then were kicked out of the other one, >>



Are you talking about TF that you only had 5 sec? Not sure what you mean here. If so then I know this is not true. You guys left in a hurry when Rad came in and ASK you to comply.



<<if anyone should be banned/kicked it should be radiation, before you lose all the people that like playing on your awesome server>>
Calling a MOB member an A@@ then disconnecting don't justify that member getting banned IMO.


<<as for why we are here- it was definitly for the level of competition we found on here.
lots of servers to choose from, i think you guys should be proud we chose this one[url="java script:emoticon("] [/url] , not question why we are here.>>



Well I can only speak for myself but I do enjoy playing with and against you guys. Although at first I did give a few warnings about some of the language used by some of you. That seems to have cleared up and in fact I saw Animal Mother get on someone the other day about his or her language. I'm not without a few choice words myself Steve, but you have to remember their are many eyes watching. Children are my biggest concern and they are on here. No, parents can't always watch them so I at least try and set a good example for our servers and try to keep it under control. If you think about it, why curse at all.




>>earlier in the day, there were two of us awol fellers, against 7 or 8 mob guys
which of course gave us the beating of a lifetime, we didnt care, glad to see more of you guys on there
thanks for the opportunity to play on here
steve hansen>>




I hope this thread will soon die and we can all get back to enjoying the game. Just have respect for everyone and if a MOB member ask you something don't fly off the handle.



All the best,

Itchweed

I suspect AWOL wouldn't have tolerated a bunch of MOB members on their server with same embarrassing language and mocking disrespect for the rules of the server...

I don't know what to think about this... The more I mull it over, and the longer it goes without a sincere apology the more unbelievable this becomes.

but i got extra butter.

1) Sgt. Hulka does NOT think MOB is scum, Sgt. Hulka was taken out of context with a screenshot. I recall typing that, quite a while back. If my memory serves me correctly, I was typing to a MOB member, or maybe "taunting" MOB members on the other team. Nevertheless, it was not meant as a derogatory remark. I like to think that I am funny, maybe that doesnt materialize in text...



2) When we went to the GFM server, we were a little upset with the threat of being kicked for not splitting up. We get in there and here comes Radiation. So being the funny guy, I made the comment of team stacking to Gump and MajorBlood (both of AWOL, both on the other team). It was 2 on 1 at the time. This is when Radiation starts "flashing his badge" threatening to kick us from that server, (does a pb kick on an empty slot, shows that he has the ability to kick). This is when I said, basically " do what you gotta do", and disconnected.

Many times I have seen players (including MOB members) use that little flaw in the game when teams are not quite even, say 10 to 9, and they want on the team with 10, So they join the team with 9 and quickly join the other. Making it very lopsided until auto-balance kicks in. When we join, if we cant all get on the same team, we will wait until someone else joins the other team. If nobody is connecting or joining after a few minutes, we will auto-assign. But I did make the comment, and it still makes sence: If we change our names and remove the AWOL tags, nobody would have a clue. There are many other players out there that have ventrilo access, that communicate together.



3)We try to keep our AWOL guys calm and in line. We would rather be known as "good people" than known as "good players". Sometimes things get said in haste that shouldnt. I will appologize for Gump for the name calling, it was not necessary.





Hulka

Ok everyone I know I'm new but heres my 2cents. I personaly dont care who is kickin my butt, what team, clan or whatever, the way I see it is ,the better players and teams I play agaist the better I am bound to get. I know that stacking may not be right but it happens. I am not writting this to stir the pot. I am hoping that eventually I can become a full fledged mob member , but I know I need to improve at my game play and gettin my butt kicked is the best way. thanks for letting me put in my 2 cents. see everyone on the field

This is another example of why we should try to make our UO servers auto assign only, like our cod2 servers. Even if you wait till the teams are evened up, you don't get to choose your team. Then, it put's you on the weeker team (I believe). So, it's pretty much impossible for guys to team stack (even MOB).

Either that, or I'm at the point I think we should change the rule, asnd say while team stacking isn't encouraged, it is not an offence and if people want to do that and occasionally win "cheap", then fine. I mean, how many times are we going to go over this? This must be the 3rd major discussion in 3 months! I don't even go on vent anymore because of this whole issue, it's sucking the life out of the game for me.

Sure is nice to play COD2 without all the bickering.....



Junkie

Why the hell is it so hard to compile when a {MOB} member ask you to do something? When i go to difference clan server and they don't like my name and ask me to change it i change it end of story! Our server our Rules!

Its getting to the point on MOB servers, where even the noobs are getting good.

There is some fierce competition.

Look at Stocks tonight. Full server. Everybody good.

Full server on Stocks !! How awesome is that?

I like having the AWOL guys in the Forest. They help keep one of my favorite maps hopping.

Well said P!!!!

T/A6Pak

I do appologize for my remarks to Radiation, sometimes my mouth,err.(typing) gets the best of me. I am ferociously loyal to AWOL and will defend any member to the end! We needed to take care of this better, (maybe a rifle butt to the head,LOL) as far as team stacking goes, this is a TEAM game. I have seen many other clans team up. I love it when they do, it makes for a better match, 1 team on another team, better commucation, better game. Anyways game on and again my appologies to MOB and Radiation.



|AWOL|Gump

As a few have said, Barb is a different animal. Although it looks like team stacking, believe it or not, the majority of the non-MOB players seem to like being on the German side. I'm usually one of the first in and I watch who goes where and the German regulars join that side rather quickly. Not only that but they hold their own quite well. I see very few games where there isn't a fierce battle to the end from both sides no matter how the teams are filled. Regular Barb players whether MOB or not need to speak up if they see this as a problem.

Barb works well just like it is for the most part. It's not like it isn't full everyday and nobody get's their arm twisted to play there.



-Pain

same with tf ,its very seldom to see a totally lopsided victory.even the noobiest noob can defend r2 or g2 . its usually alot of normal players or other clans though. i do agree with bargod , it would be nice to have an auto assign. p makes a valid point as well , ive been asked to switch teams or whatever from the many servers ive played , their rules so i do it .

to junkie- you guys used to have a problem with team stacking in cod2 until the auto assign,there was alot of bickering back then ,if i remember correctly.

I really am tired of hearing the teamstacking complaint. Yesterday, I think I was the only MOB playing on barb around 2-3pm and this clan DLS came in and basically all went on one side. As the match went on, some were auto balanced to my team and it was fine. Yea, it was hard in the begining, because it took a huge defensive effort to hang on long enough for the teams to even out and be able to get a victory late. I love playing with friends as im sure most clans do as well. Some even just like to play one side. I see many who like German side (MOD) and many who like Russian side (Me). Most of the time the games are awesome. There is occasional whoppins by both sides. Even when there are more MOB on one side, I have seen the other side win just as much. So please stop with the MOB should split up on each side crap. MOD, I dont see how vent is taking the life out of the game for you, its always allot of fun on vent. Even if the vent channel is split with german and russian players on it. We love talking crap to one another.

I think having auto-assign on Barb would be a bad thing to do. The server is popular for the way we have it. Why change it? I think its fine the way it is.

Firstly, I don't like the German side, I just always auto-assign lately because of all the complaining about this, and I always end up on German because Russians usually have the extra player or 2.

I don't go on vent much because, yes, people in vent team stack, and I used to join them and have fun playing on the same team but with all the complaining about it I've been auto-assigning and like I say, that usually means German, so I'm usually the "odd man out". I don't like being on Vent when I'm the only guy on the other team. In fact, I hate it. I feel like a tool. But if I "team stack" then I'm breaking the rules. So I'm damned either way. So I just basically pulling away from vent, and like I say, that's sucked some of the fun out of it.

In fact, THREE TIMES I've seen someone here post a screenshot of a "stacked" team where I was on the "stacked team" except, every single time, I autoassigned! I tell ya, it's not fun being accused of teamstacking when you didn't even do it. I wish we'd drop it and say, team stack all you want. I'm tired of pleasing nobody while trying to please everybody.

Just wondering how many people read the original post??? The topic seems very off course.

T/A6Pak

Well 6pak, it was just gonna go there. Did you have any doubts? LOL!

MOD, you are reading way too much into all of this. I know, because I have done it too. Get on vent, join the game, pick a side and HAVE FUN! That's it! Have a good time and if you get autoscrewed, then deal with THAT when it happens! LOL!