| Cpt. Snot Rocket |
09/05/07 11:06pm
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#1
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Colonel ![]() Group: {MOB} Posts: 1304 Joined: February 26th 2006 From: South Bend, IN Member No.: 1615 |
September 4, 2007
Michael Moore wants socialized medicine in the United States. It would, as his film Sicko suggests, give us a system that better delivers health care to those who need it. Although Moore effectively documents some deficiencies in American health care, his message is undermined by misinformation, inconsistent rhetoric, and a disingenuous agenda. Moore's plan would result in worse, not better, health outcomes for Americans — including the poor and underserved. As a hand surgeon who treats many traumatic injuries, Moore's portrayal of a patient who amputated his middle fingertip captured my interest. He depicted this uninsured man as required to pay $23,000 to have his finger "saved." Moore lost considerable credibility here. Most hand surgeons would never consider micro-surgically replanting this table saw injury at the finger nail base. Rather, this unfortunate injury would have been comfortably and safely treated — without reattachment of the severed bit of finger — in an office procedure room for $1,000 or less. In Sicko, Moore consistently equated lack of insurance with inability to obtain care. In Grand Rapids, Mich., where I practice, a sign on the front door of Blodgett hospital, in English and Spanish, indicates patients will not be turned away for lack of ability to pay. This is policy across the United States. We hear a lot about the nearly 50 million Americans without health insurance. However, approximately half of them are insured six months later with new jobs, suggesting more of a problem with our employer based health care system than with affordability. Moore harshly criticizes the U.S. government. Yet he is arguing for a centrally controlled allocation of health care resources. Who does he want to run health care in this country? Medical resources are not unlimited. The combination of aging demographics, technological advances and unconstrained consumption within our third party payment system has led to an unsustainable trajectory of ever increasing spending. It is already clear that price controls have created strong disincentives to debt-burdened students considering careers in primary care. Yet Sicko gives market oriented solutions no consideration. Three individuals with ailments after admirably serving in New York rescue and recovery efforts after September 11, 2001, were transparently used in Sicko to promote Moore's agenda. This manipulation was as revolting as the stories of individuals egregiously denied care by insurance companies. Transported to Cuba, the three 9-11 patients were shown to Cuban doctors who (while cameras were rolling) appeared more than happy to provide care and subsidized prescriptions. This contrasted with a California hospital denying care to a child with a severe infection and a sick, elderly woman dropped off by a taxi in front of a rescue mission while still in her hospital gown. The latter two tragic situations were portrayed as illustrative examples of our domestic medical system. There is no question we need major improvement in U.S. health care. To use a few outrageous anecdotes to argue for a socialized solution, however, is a non-sequitur. Despite ostensibly compassionate intentions on the part of its backers, greater harm would result from centrally planned and controlled health care. Canada and the United Kingdom provide contemporary models: rationing occurs by decree and delay. Even the Canadian Supreme Court, when ruling against Canada's single-payer law prohibiting private payment for health care in 2006, stated, "access to a waiting list is not access to health care ... in some cases patients die as a result of waiting lists for public health care ... and many patients on non-urgent waiting lists are in pain and cannot fully enjoy any real quality of life." Pope Benedict XVI wrote in his recent encyclical Deus Caritas Est, "We do not need a State which regulates and controls everything, but a State which, in accordance with the principles of subsidiarity, generously acknowledges and supports initiatives arising from the different social forces and combines spontaneity with closeness to those in need." Moore and his allies would do well to take this exhortation to heart. We now have unsustainable consumption of medical resources, with third party responsibility for health care expenses. A socialized system would increase state dependency and diminish motivation for charity. Greater government bureaucracy would increase inefficiency and waste compared to doctor-patient "two-party" interaction. Socialized medicine violates the social justice principle of subsidiarity by interfering with the family, churches, charitable clinics, and other intermediate organizations attending to those who are most in need. The common good would be better served with medical insurance purchased, like other insurance, outside the workplace. Tax law changes could help improve insurance portability and affordability. Insurance industry reform, including measures increasing inter-state competition, could decrease premium cost. Greater competition from patients directly paying premiums would lead to stronger demands for quality and less egregious denials of care. With improved alignment of responsibility for personal health choices and medical care consumption, scarce health care resource allocation would improve. There is significant opportunity for recovery. Market oriented reforms, with compassionate consideration for those without means, deserve far greater consideration than Sicko's deceptive solution. Dr. Donald P. Condit is an orthopaedic surgeon specializing in hand surgery in Grand Rapids, Mich. He also holds an MBA degree from the Seidman School of Business at Grand Valley State University. (This article is a product of the Acton Institute — www.acton.org, 161 Ottawa NW, Suite 301, Grand Rapids, MI 49503 — and is reprinted with permission.) -------------------- |
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| Barkmann |
09/06/07 3:51pm
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#2
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Colonel ![]() Group: {MOB} Regs Posts: 1034 Joined: December 1st 2006 From: Toronto/Canada Member No.: 2291 Xfire: barkmann77 |
Free health care in Canada? As Canadians we still have to pay for it, its called taxes.
And are health care system is not that good now since we have too maney ppl now. More doctor are leaving to go to work in the US. Hospitals are low on beds, doctors, in Toronto we cant even get a bloody MIR machine [gov't too cheap to get one] we have to fix the system. We need more doctors more beds more machines to help the sick. I got hurt at work one night went to the hospital and waiting something like 6 bloody hours to see a doctor. Then theres stories about ppl dieing befor they get into the hospital, because they get turn away. I dont know how it is across Canada but i do know how it is here in Torornto/Ontario -------------------- ![]() Everything is funny as long as it is happening to somebody else. |
| M@ster of Dis@ster |
09/06/07 5:00pm
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#3
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![]() Colonel ![]() Group: {MOB} Regs Posts: 1153 Joined: February 16th 2006 Member No.: 1598 Xfire: Master0fDisaster |
Free health care in Canada? As Canadians we still have to pay for it, its called taxes. And are health care system is not that good now since we have too maney ppl now. More doctor are leaving to go to work in the US. Hospitals are low on beds, doctors, in Toronto we cant even get a bloody MIR machine [gov't too cheap to get one] we have to fix the system. We need more doctors more beds more machines to help the sick. I got hurt at work one night went to the hospital and waiting something like 6 bloody hours to see a doctor. Then theres stories about ppl dieing befor they get into the hospital, because they get turn away. I dont know how it is across Canada but i do know how it is here in Torornto/Ontario I live in PEI and even work in a hosptial, and it is really good here. Not perfect mind you, but overall excellent care, people leave pleased and happy, and no one, rich or poor, has to wiegh the pros and cons about going to a hospital to get a potentially severe issue looked at because on concerns about cost. In Canada, health care is a right, not a privledge. I prefer it that way. And if anyone ever want to come take a tour of the hospital I work at, I'd be pleased to show you. It is new, sparkling clean, and well run. Also, the reason Toronto/Ontario might be spreading it's money too thin in health care might have to do with the fact they have the lowest taxes in Canada after many cuts in the 90's, aside from uber-rich Alberta. Yes, health care costs money. But provinces can buy equipment, drugs, etc. at far reduced rates thanks to economies of scale than a million HMO's can in the US, which also scoop their profits off the top. That why Canadians pay far less ever for paid prescription drugs than actual Americans do, even for drugs MADE in AMERICA! That's the "free market" for you...but it's not working for the average American...it's working for their drug companies though. In term of percentage of our GDP, Canada pays far less than the US for it's overal health care costs. Places like Ontario could put more money in and fix those issues, and still face less cost overall than the US pays out, even though 20% of US citizens aren't even covered. However, if Americans don't want medicare and don't care that at any time 1 in 6 Americans faces financial ruin, or worse, if something serious happens, that is certainly their right. I will just say that I like Canada's system and wish it to remain, and believe there's enough money to go around to afford to fix any issue in certain areas. Unlike some other countries, Canada consistently has surpluses and can direct more money to fix issues if it wishes. That's what I'd prefer. Most every European country is public as well, and face lower wait times than the US and Canada. Canada can fix it's issues with a little more money (including money for doctors), and still pay less per ratio of GDP than the States. Oh, and cover all it's citizens, rich, poor, recently jobless, children...everyone. That's a part of Canada I like and am proud of. This post has been edited by M@ster of Dis@ster: 09/06/07 5:05pm -------------------- ![]() |
Cpt. Snot Rocket What's Wacko about Sicko 09/05/07 11:06pm
Genocide Junkie But we're entitled to "free" health ... 09/05/07 11:39pm
flatliner Government programs include education.... 09/05/07 11:48pm
UNDEAD 1 i think the problems lie with doctors over chargin... 09/06/07 5:43am
{CuF}crazycanuck we have universal health care in Canada. Although ... 09/06/07 5:54am
Cpt. Snot Rocket That's some great and honest input Canuck... 09/06/07 9:03am
Capt. Andtennille ... Having the goverment control this is insane... 09/06/07 10:00am
UNDEAD 1 First off we already have govt run health care ,yo... 09/06/07 10:44am
Blitz Nothing in life is ever free!
The socalist ... 09/06/07 7:03pm
Genocide Junkie Part of the problem is the liability that the doct... 09/06/07 7:46pm
Blitz I agree that insurance companies are a large part ... 09/06/07 10:02pm
UNDEAD 1 for the record i agree with your original post tow... 09/06/07 10:45pm
Cross of Iron The UK does have a "free health care" an... 09/07/07 2:23am
M@ster of Dis@ster
The UK does have a "free health care" a... 09/07/07 7:29am
Capt. Andtennille
THe problem in the UK is they mixed public and p... 09/19/07 9:03am
Hellfighter
THe problem in the UK is they mixed public and ... 09/21/07 6:46pm
T/A6Pak A big problem with the Canadian health care is tha... 09/19/07 1:16pm
M@ster of Dis@ster
A big problem with the Canadian health care is th... 09/19/07 2:37pm
Cpt. Snot Rocket
A big problem with the Canadian health care is t... 09/20/07 5:32pm
Capt. Andtennille [quote name='M@ster of Dis@ster' post='160869' da... 09/21/07 11:06am
Keystone Two-Eight September 4, 2007
Michael Moore wants
That... 09/19/07 4:27pm
Genocide Junkie I know this thread is pretty much dead but I caugh... 10/09/07 2:58pm
Ghost Child If the USA got universal health care, where would ... 10/11/07 9:38pm
Hellfighter If the USA got universal health care, where would... 10/13/07 10:58am![]() ![]() |
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